Opinion and Discussion, with all the toxic inbetween

What  a tormented world, where we are between self expression,  facts and firm beliefs being dragged into a quagmire of toxic interactions.    How do we manage this unending  stream of uncivil discourse?     It isn’t simple but I will break it down.    It relies on discipline, self awareness and boundaries.

The first two are the hardest, discipline and self awareness.    Self awareness perhaps the hardest of the two.    I can  and usually do go on about meditation,  sorting ones minds and emotions, and choosing actions, thoughts and emotions, I won’t here.  This takes years of discipline and practice.    Discipline which is equally important, the willingness to reflect, self audit each and every reaction, and hone actions and reactions with conscious and deliberate forethought and planning.   Discipline is about decisions and creating a habit.      This is where most people lapse into addictions what they believe about themselves, and don’t do the continuous work to improve.     One must get past that, one has to have tools to make decisions from.


Boundaries whether they are external landmarks or internal checks and balances,  the limits have to be defined.   Our capabilities have to be assessed and honestly know ones limits.

Magnum Force Poster

Harry Callahan: A man’s GOT to know his limitations.

This is where it gets difficult.       I have been accused of coming to a verbal knife fight with a gatling gun.     I  may have had the last word, and shut the conversation to the stand still.    But the cases where I did this I never convinced anyone.  And I am sure I didn’t make any new friends.    

A discussion or civil discourse is when two sides talk about facts, where they got them, mull over their value, experiences, identify each other’s concerns and if an action is needed how to go about taking an action, and backing it out or altering it as it goes.    This doesn’t happen very often except maybe at some jobs, and the boss, supervisor or leader, has a final say of the direction to be taken.   Too often the leader has to quell arguments and opinions.  They decide the action, their position and authority is accepted and the world keeps on working, usually.

Any step further  goes down.    Not unlike  from the movie the Mummy.

Image result for mummy movie scenes

Arguments,  may use experiences, anecdotes, similes, metaphors  and yet like a discussion a solid answer isn’t really known.     Experiences from a certain set of circumstances may have more weight than others, it is how we handle this information.  As soon as opinion comes to play all hopes of civil discourse disappears into the gaping void.  And like any good intention, it paves the road to hell.  

Logical discussions  are based on a common set of language, a common set of facts, and usually an equal understanding what those facts mean.     A logical argument starts with a set of priories.   A set of assumptions that all parties understand  that they are working with.   A good philosophical debate, will worry over most meanings of words, what they mean, and the assumptions or priories that one is working with.     Logically, based on what those assumptions are or are not,  the pros and cons can be of an idea can be discussed.

Opinions are based on personal assumptions.  The assertion of opinions are set out  as assumptions.      When people get back to these assumptions, regardless of the discussion, those assumptions if taken personally, the discussion ends.       Personal based beliefs or assumptions, that are part of an opinion are not up for debate.  End of story.  Beliefs are not necessarily rational.               I believe a table is blue, other people see it as a table and is blue, I don’t believe it any more, I know, and I know they know.     As soon as I say I believe in a fact,   the fact  becomes part  of a questionable experience.     That fact is held onto with emotional investment, from experience.     The belief someone uses has an equal or strong amount of emotion invested in it.      There are stories, similes, metaphors  and illogical leaps of  assignment of emotions to something portrayed similar to an idea or a supposition.    A strongly held belief, that underlies someone’s opinion, makes that opinion off limits for discussion.   One may want to engage you with their opinion, but it is not for a discussion but for proselytization.    They want support for their belief.      This is were discussion should end.  

We don’t set the boundary to end the discussion.  We don’t realize that the discussion is over.    Whether it is facts, beliefs, sound logic or emotionally linked rationale,  people get drawn into all the toxic slugfest of what the  Greek philosophers called Sophistry.  

How do we tell when the discussion is over. 

Liberally taken from online Dictionary.   Techniques of rhetoric are examples.

Bombast is when high-sounding language with little meaning is used to impress people.

Hyperbole is when exaggerated statements or claims not meant to be taken literally are made.

Simile  is used when a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lioncrazy like a fox ).

Exhortation is an address or communication emphatically urging someone to do something.

Straw man argument is an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent’s real argument.

False equivalence is a logical fallacy in which two completely opposing arguments appear to be logically equivalent when in fact they are not. This fallacy is categorized as a fallacy of inconsistency.

Up to this point, one can start looking at the method of arguments.    Identify that the opinions and rationalizations are opinions and  hard held beliefs.     Recognize it, say so, and let it go.         The stinging thing can be said about how you feel and think about the sources of these arguments.   This does not win friends.                When it is based on societal imprinting  and hard held emotionally charged opinions, these feelings make sense to them.  The ideas are strung together  with emotionally charged feelings about each point of the argument.  The lapses of logic  and connection are glossed over with the emotions of what feels right and what makes sense.    

There is no way one can wedge sense, ones own emotions, or  logic into these beliefs.    The addiction to this whole pattern of belief and rationalization go to the core of the person’s and sadly a large section of society beliefs in who they are.  The moment you make them uncomfortable, with facts, and your own feelings (and they will be dismissed) because they can’t feel like themselves, the emotional shift does not square with their feelings, and their ability to think doesn’t fit either.    The whole thought process is usually hijacked with propaganda, a culturally contrived sense of right and wrong with a series of connected feelings with facts  and lies that are loosely connected.  The belief is based on what feels right.    The loss of identity and a sense of self, will be fought back aggressively.  

Sadly it has become ingrained into the American psyche as a cultural norm to also use abusive techniques.    This is a boundary that needs to be set as a hard limit.    The perpetrators will not change.  This is the nature of  parasites and that of sociopaths, narcissists and psychopaths.         The boundary between believers and abusers  is getting murkier than ever.

Ad hominen  is an argument or reaction directed against a person rather than the position they are maintaining.

Gaslighting    is when one manipulates someone by psychological means into questioning their own sanity.

Sealioning (also spelled sea-lioning and sea lioning) is a type of trolling or harassment which consists of pursuing people with persistent requests for evidence or repeated questions, while maintaining a pretense of civility ( Poland, Bailey (November 2016). Haters: Harassment, Abuse, and Violence OnlineUniversity of Nebraska Press. pp. 144–145. ISBN978-1-61234-766-0.)

There are the more abusive patterns than just  Gas-lighting etc.   https://thoughtcatalog.com/shahida-arabi/2016/06/20-diversion-tactics-highly-manipulative-narcissists-sociopaths-and-psychopaths-use-to-silence-you/

and  https://www.inc.com/jessica-stillman/10-popular-techniques-used-by-manipulators-and-how-to-fight-them.html

In the above articles, they start using the concept of triangulation.    This is were they develop co-dependents and enablers to further abuse their victims.                And victims band together  to survive this also.  Then it becomes this toxic us or them mindset.   Which is true.   And  the abusers will use projection,  to make them look like the victim.

This brings us to the point where we develop ethnocentrism. A convenient way to  set social boundaries without calling it bigotry.     The Bigotry is based on the abusive non-inclusive  type of behavior, or the outright abusive proselytizing. 

The sad fact of the matter, is when the abused as co-dependents stop being enablers, or continue being victims, they learn to be abusers themselves or counter-dependents.     https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/theory-knowledge/201404/signs-counter-dependency     or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterdependency  for more information.   It can be  self protective measure, or becomes its own  toxic condition with others.  

There are techniques on dealing with all of this.    This information is all about definitions on how you can set boundaries.     Once you understand it and choose to change your behavior, based on those boundaries, it is your choice on whether or not you get out of  toxic  communications of opinions, beliefs or propaganda.        My go to method is to leave the argument, distance myself from the people,  and if called for  call out the issues listed above.   I am not attacking, just their method of  verbal assault.   Because it is definitely not a discussion nor will it be civil discourse.        Too often when it gets toxic, the abusers has their co-dependents attacking you.    Out of sight out of mind, and  those that will need healing and help after they too become victims, won’t have the thought of you contaminated.     It is tough, to just walk away from letting insanity, lies and deceit fester.     The only thing it will do is damage you.    In workplace situations, do what you can, play the games  in the articles, and usually get yourself out of there and be appreciated somewhere else.  And get out before you become the same as the victimizers.    That is hard to do.  

There is a personal acquaintance that I am developing a friendship with.   The issue of  the Honduran asylum seekers were brought up.     The association of these refugees were made to like an army, an invasion force, and people coming into one’s personal home and taking everything.   I tested those assumptions.  They were all knocked down.    The political facts, the false equivalences were presented and were summarily dismissed.  Then I was asked for more arguments, that is sea-lioning.     I said so, and the opinions and assumptions are based on external propaganda that was inciting hate and fear.    I  didn’t mean to, but, I dismissed them being  his own personal hard felt beliefs  and opinions.    I truthfully gave my opinion of the sources of those assumptions.    But I also drew a line and exited the argument.     Also I said anything I say or do in regards to that discussion would only excite that fear and anger that those  arguments, rationale of those hard held opinions.      Fear and Hate are unquenchable fires, the only thing one can do is not feed them.

This has taken me literally decades to develop the discipline, and practice along with the self awareness, to not allow myself to get drawn into an unwinnable conversation.   It wasn’t a discussion or an argument.   My choice of ending that discourse on my part was hard, but in my own defense necessary.    Don’t attack the speaker, attack the method,  the lack of of facts, or the source of them, and get the hell out.   The testing of their assumptions, feelings and opinions will be personal enough and will make the person feel attacked.      Assumptions, feelings and opinions that a person doesn’t  check for validity, it reflects what they feel and take for granted about themselves.         Seeing and hearing that, don’t attack them, you call them beliefs and opinions you don’t share, and get the hell out of the conversation.             

Hopefully with boundaries and discipline with self awareness,  the toxic rhetoric  avoided, you will change or define how you will discuss things with people.    If by setting an example, and boundaries,  this will at least for you improve what acceptable conversations would be.     This is a perfect example of not falling into a level beneath you.  Why, you set boundaries, and with self discipline and self awareness, you set boundaries for your self and bar that must be met when dealing with you.       It  has over the years helped me stave off a lot of people playing these mind games on me, wittingly or not.                

Today is so difficult to have civil and meaningful discourse and discussions, that presages the fall of a great society, into isolated squabblers that others can manipulate.    It is my hope the readers of this will endeavor to set examples in our society, so we can start the journey toward healing ourselves and our society.

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Silence, this little book eat it up, you can’t hear this.

Communication, its lack, and miscommunication, plague people who won’t learn to be uncomfortable.

One of the hardest things for people learning the witches triangle is silence.

Then there is cast not pearls to swine.

And in many cases, all the words in the world will never help someone to understand something when they don’t have a common frame of reference.

Spiritual societies, initiatory traditions, and coming of age type of rituals, are designed to impart what is ineffable.   But once  experienced, the brotherhood now has a common frame of reference where the nuances of each other’s experiences can be understood.

People have a need to be accepted by others, and too often when they speak they parrot back their cultural programming, expecting to hear it from everyone around them.     This indicates whether or not you are part of that group.

Some people have a need to be right.  They can be all sorts of wrong, but the identity of self with their world view  is so strong, their ego can’t handle any other information, facts or ways of looking at things.

This is an addiction.

An excellent article came out a while ago describing addiction  as an addiction to a perception of self.    Granted  chemical addiction is horrible, mind altering, and a detriment to a person’s health.      If a person gets  free of the effects of the drug, the physical addiction, they still have a psychological addiction.     Why is that?    The metabolism that a person has had as an addict, they have learned how to function as a functional addict, accessing memories and behavioral faculties.     Without the chemical crutch, the metabolism  necessary to achieve  the state of mind where all of one’s memories and faculties isn’t available.     This is an addiction to one’s sense of self.    Behavioral addiction of expecting to light up a cigarette or smoke on queue from situations, is a matter of breaking habits.     But the metabolism  and feelings, where one is at their peak efficiency of being themselves is off.            In other words, people’s proficiencies are at a peak with their metabolism establish by drugs of choice.

This feeling and self assessment of how we function is a consciousness of and the feelings of knowing and being comfortable with who you are.  This makes them feel comfortable.   Not being yourself, you are not comfortable.   This theory of addiction to self, with chemical addictions is called state dependent behavior.  Our behaviors are based on the metabolic dependent state where we know and control our behaviors.   Our behaviors confirm a comfort of what we are use to.  This is ego, and the support of that ego is Maya.

So how does “State Dependent Behavior” affect the average person.           People have 7 – 12 standard sets of emotions, give or take.   Each emotional state is like an operating system where they access memories and their faculties/programming.       Each emotion is its own operating system.    People may share memories between these operating systems or metabolic states that represent in person a feeling.             Memories may have been shared, and faculties and reasoning may be shared  between these metabolisms, if a person is coherent.     Incoherent people, may have inconsistent emotions, memories and faculties from one emotional state to another.     Either way they are addicted to their sense and awareness of  the flow of feelings and information, in a comfort of who they are regardless of what they are feeling.    Consciousness is less about awareness it is about the feeling of connectedness  of the various aspects of self, throughout any of their accepted emotions.              People can be addicted to being miserable.   They are comfortable with who they are and can function in that state.     They are addicted to their state dependent behaviors.    This is ego and its support is Maya.    Chemical addicts, have a chemical that just skews this emotional baseline.  It is still the same.

It is this idea of self, ego, and sense of comfort of knowing who one is by the feelings and reaction to information and the world around them,  is an addiction.      There are  people who more adaptable to being uncomfortable and embracing the feelings of others through empathy, relearning to access memories and faculties from a different metabolism.

Case in point, I am a member of Toastmasters.   One of our member’s project she chose was what to do about about bullying.          I have been bullied a lot in school, and in many ways since.   I being a white male, don’t look like I should be at the receiving end of bullying.   If you work in America, you experienced varying degrees of it.     I spoke about it, and have very well thought out views on what to do, what steps needed to change the culture, etc. and responding to people whose responses were to much like victim blaming, and rape culture mentality.   I was emotional.     From every member from a disenfranchised  group, they liked what I had to say, and enjoyed the passion or emotions I brought to speaking.         The white male  conservative, told me flat out I needed to calm down, that I was being too emotional.

Social Privilege expects to be comfortable.    In this case it was a white conservative male.   A previous democratic presidential candidate Howard Dean in celebrating a victory made a guttural  “Arrrr”.    Subsequent primaries he was canned, panned and turned out for being outwardly emotional.               Many studies in the United States, leaders were people that people could feel emotionally safe.               In this past election of 45, it was someone played  on reflecting the emotions, of a segment of society, where they could feel themselves reflected in this now president.    Two edges of the same sword, taking advantage of people’s own addiction to the comfort of themselves.

I have always been the odd man out.  I was too smart as a child,  too big, too active, too intellectual.   I was a child.  I was not listened to.   Whether I was being bullied, telling the truth, or just trying to explain  the bullying I was receiving.   I couldn’t be related to.  I made people uncomfortable.   It was easier to not believe me.        I got older,  my opinions and views didn’t matter because I was a white male,   not a father, not old enough, not from this clique, this group or banter sports, cars or sexual exploits.   I did not fit and no matter what I said, how I said it, I didn’t fit.   I made people uncomfortable.    Fortunately in IT  being odd, and intelligent I had a better purchase on this playing field.    However, I was not, testosterone poisoned emotional misfit, where most relearn their social queues in a stunted brain, in a more juvenile construct of society, where I had to learn to suck up to the chief troglodyte of any other group.         A repeated rendition of the same level of institutional abuse in a new venue.

What I found out sadly disenfranchised groups of people, if deprived of social conditioning in their teen years,  develop it in their disenfranchised niche, and repeat the same high school level of unsophisticated control and manipulation.   Along with the learned behaviors of sociopaths and narcissists that they have been victimised from.

Victims who work toward being empowered, get  to be victims again or trusted sycophants and enablers.    The new abusers learn to be experts at their new social venue.             And some of the  repeat victims learn to fight back.

Those who fight abuse, end up reflecting some of the characteristics of abusers.   There is a fine line where victims either learn to stay victims, become abusers themselves or “counter-dependents”      Counter-dependence was  described in another psychological journal.  People fight not to be victims, and standing up for victims, have traits that  look like the unsophisticated abusers of the past.     So they are dismissed and victimized yet again at whole new level.

Silence and retreat is left for those who won’t fit in the template of society, abuser or victim.   Silence and retreat, is left for those who learn to be uncomfortable and learn to hold on to truth regardless of the situation.  They certainly were never accepted to be part of a cultural milieu to reinforce  comfortable rationalizations, true or not, of ways of being, thinking and information fit for that groups survival.         In other words, truth isn’t necessary.  As long as the  information used between the group that created the effecting controls of reality to keep them alive, truth is irrelevant.  Another scientific study showing people use information fit for survival.

I am a pagan,  in the late 70’s and 80’s, being a white male was an anathema for all those who were fighting the male patriarchy.     Not that I was, I fit the symbols and handles.   30 years later, I got to a ecumenical convention for pagans, the experiences spiritually and studies I have had,  there was a consensus amongst the elders of many traditions, I was elder in my own right.  These were special interfaith pagan elders, most of them.

A convention I was at last month, again, reinforced that I need to be silent and retreat.     I see warm loving people who are all about love, light and liberty.    Their approach is to educate, love and share to bridge the gaps in groups and in humanity.        I don’t have that this implicit or explicit viewpoint.  It works to degrees where people want to grow and change.     If any of what I wrote above has impressed on you, and made painfully aware to me, a vast majority of people are unwilling and incapable of changing.  They will fight to retain their comfort, their privileged positions.    The level of empathy only extends to those closer to them than anyone outside of their comfort level.             Even disenfranchised people, people who are liberal empathic, loving and caring, they can’t see how I can be hard, speak hard and want people to survive the evils that exist and are yet to come.

One third of the United States voted for, and maintain an affiliation with people who hate.   They choose philosophies that are devoid of empathy for any living being or people other than themselves and their own.   They have betrayed the constitution, their faiths in Christianity, and lock step with the goose stepping fascist of this country and pre World War II Germany.      I lived in an exit community in the suburbs.   People fighting to get out of the ghettos, and those through  their unfitness for society or bad luck were falling back into ghettos.      My neighborhood had 2 drug gangs based on age, and prostitute house mismanaged by the neighborhood girls all who were under 18.    I survived them and their parents who were sociopaths, addicts and narcissists.    I can recognize these type of people in all sectors of society.   I work very hard not to be a victim.

The one thing I know for sure, sociopaths and psychopaths, don’t have empathy.   They never apologize and they never can change.   The only time they apologize is when they see a threat of pain, discomfort or death.  Then it is a convenient lie to get to the next game.          They can only be managed by a constant threat of pain, or death.       This is a cold hard fact that makes everyone uncomfortable.       People can’t imagine that is true, and the abusers will go out of their way to get enablers  to act against anyone who tells the truth and can see them for what they are.

Now people may be victimized by these individuals on rare occasions.    Rape culture, sealioning, gas lighting, perpetuates a victimology.      For others, it is so outside of their comfort level to recognize this evil in other people.           It is easier to believe the liar and abuser than the victim.

I went to a pagan gathering.  I tried to explain that the growing threat in our country of embolden sociopaths, that we need to be prepared.   Love and light, and you are out and don’t fit.   My language is too hard.   And,  “who hurt you”.    Now at first, I thought that this is a legitimate thing to think of that  a person has been so unlucky to be in the minds of being so hard and adamant.      Okay, this is true.   But I don’t deny, education, love, empathy and any means and methods to make bridges and establish communication between people.   The Pagan communities are just starting to do this more than ever.    The past 30 – 40 years, ego, and control of ones own empowerment, dealing all of the low level abusers, and cleaning them out of the community,  there is this light, love and sense of maturity.     Good, they have earned it.

Silence and retreat.      “Who Hurt You”, not only  made plain I was on the outside again, it presented me as a damaged person to the group and made what ever truth or value I had to offer null and void.                Next verse same as the first.  Silence and retreat.

My teacher called me a “white hat”.    Everyone else was shopkeepers.      We aren’t in the old west, and it isn’t evident to these good folk of the town, what it takes to protect them from the “black hats”.      They may invite a white hat to dinner, but they will never be part of their social group or invited to play pinochle.      A White Hat has to love these shopkeepers and what they stand for.  But what shopkeepers see is  someone harder, faster and meaner than the black hats, no matter how kind and caring they are in town.

The West African stories of the Oriesha and Loa from Ile’ Ifa or Voodou, don’t speak to this.    All of the Oriesha and Loa fit the village except one or three.    Ile’ Ifa or Voodou is a religion and its magic is supernatural dealing with these venerate ancestors and the supreme being Oludumare.            The one who doesn’t fit is Ochossi.  Ochossi is called the king of the witches.  Witches are hated, they don’t venerate or work with the Loa or Oriesha.   Their magic deals with power,  the dead and power of the land.     Usually they act selfishly because they are on the fringe of society.    The African beliefs encouraged community, working with each other, in their beliefs, divination systems and stories.     It took Abrahamic religions to destroy that.

All of the Oriesha and Loa have “roads”  lessons to be learned or paths, that reflect in their adherents lives who have the influence or head of the Loa or Oriesha.    The one Exception is Ochossi.  His roads are hidden.      He is respected by the old King Obatala or Damballah.  But he is still not part of the village unless called upon to serve justice.  He is part of the woods, and his other function is to find new places for new villages.

There comes a time when the old villages die or get murdered  or the people destroy themselves.    Ochossi helps them build that new village.  Obatala is the new king for a short time and put to pasture.

He has experiences and insights that the village people will not and can not hear.  They have no common frame of reference.   The religion, and the Oriesha and Loa fit in the standard sets of emotions and experience expected out of a community and a culture.    They make things comfortable.         Ochossi  isn’t allowed to feel comfortable.    Thanks for having me as fifth wheel, I’ll go back to the woods, again.  Silence and retreat.

There is one story that is hidden, that I learned.       It is a side story for when the world was new, and the souls of the dead were wandering around,  It was getting to be noisy and unhealthy for the living and the Oriesha and Loa.     Yemaya  the mother of the Loa and Oriesha was tasked of managing the souls.  They are said to become  fish.  In other stories the fish went to the horizon and became stars, and returned to the earth to be reincarnated.         The Sub-Saharan pre-Sumerian script that has elements going all the way across Asia the symbol for fish and star were very similar.   It shows up in Egyptian cosmology and motifs.           For this to happen, the Oriesha and Loa had to accept the touch of Iku or Death.                Here is the hidden story,  Ochossi chose to touch death or Iku himself.            Ode was a hunter who had no name who loved Yemaya in some stories that bore the Oriesha.    Ochossi was an ode, a hunter.  His son, Er-Inle was a hunter and fisherman.   Oshun didn’t keep her son, when Chango was around.     Ode knew old magic, and old truth.  He was one with the forest and the trees.    Where did Iroko come from?  Who did he learn what he taught Orunmila/Orunla?    Ochossi had his magics.    Er-Inle learned the ancient magics of Yemaya, and his tongue was cut out.  He went to live in the swamp, a place for outcasts, with another Snake Oriesha/Loa Abata.

They can not teach people the truth, the magics, or their insights.  They have carried it from lifetime to lifetime.    Iku was an old old friend.  Embracing Iku, they would find themselves as themselves in the next lifetime, under new circumstances.             It is the hunter that helps build the new village, establishes its justice, and protects it from the bad influences.   He is a leader for a very short while.    He returns to the home that loves him and embraces him, the universe.  He can travel back and forth from Obatala and Oludumare.  Elegua knows of his travels, but hasn’t lived his experiences.

I can not speak the truth that people are not ready to learn to live with.     We have to be there to build what is no more.  Repair what no one thinks to fix.  To work old and ancient magics that none are prepared to deal with.   Self Sacrifice and embrace Iku, to make it work.    The story of Aslan in Narnia, he knew of the deeper magic, that the ice queen didn’t.  Self sacrifice brought him back to life.

This is why the roads are hidden.  Not because they can’t be learned or experienced.  It is because most people even spiritual ones are not prepared to do the sacrifices of the self to learn this path of ordeals and trials.

I freely chose this.   Silence and retreat, is not my nature, but it is required, when you are not accepted in the village, even though you love the people and are willing to fight the evils that they can’t conceive of.

John here is this little book, eat it up, tarry till I come.     Occasionally a rogue star will pulls stars to a new constellation.    Heaven and Earth shall roll away, and a new Heaven and Earth shall unfold.  Many mysteries.  Each ineffable.   Spoken and unheard are true nevertheless.

There will come a time  where people will have to trust people who traversed hells and survived it versus the people who drag people into a hell and leave them there.

How to know yourself and preparation of managing of being uncomfortable.

How to develop skills to deal with being uncomfortable. 

Side note:   The apocalypse,  when will it come?  It will come as a thief in the night.

This biblical sidebar exemplifies the blindness and absolute complicitness of this age, the people of the United States, it’s Christians who pray and actively work toward the nihilism of the end of times.  They have brought it upon themselves and are the very evil agents that have engendered it through their nascience.

Ancient numerology, Greek and Hebrew, do not reveal it.   It is only revealed in modern numerology, that  same number of the Sun 666.     The beast is known as 666, is a thief in the night, a FOX.     F = 6, O = 6 + 9 (remove the nines), and X = 6 + 9 + 9 (remove the nines) is 666.    The whore of Babylon is known by the same number  her name is Alec.  ALEC;  (A = 1) + (E = 5) = 6; (L = 3) + (C = 3) = 6.     Modern numerology of a name takes the vowels and consonants separately.       Together it adds up to a 3.   Where is the last 6?   ALEC    is short for American Legislative Exchange Council which reduces to a 33  or a 6.     Blind and complicit in its creation.

The Sun whose number is 666 was a metaphor for the Golden Emperor Constantine.  The off gold 45 and love of gold, is but a servant.

Not speaking for the OTO and being a Thelemite,  Babalon vs Babylon, and Baphomet are not of this biblical currents and metaphors.    Like the yin yang symbol there is always a seed of the opposite embedded in a time and a place.   Will it flower fully, only to those who keep the secret.  What secret,  ones that are published openly.   Again the truth is there.   Psalms 82  …. know ye not ye are gods….       and in the NT, you can become brothers and sisters of Christ.   Not his children, but full siblings.  There is no part of me that is not of the Gods.

I love this country, I served as a Marine, I do not love the government.  The constitution was flawed and had the opportunity to be amended to fulfill its charter for Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness.     Rome died.  Various iterations of France’s revolutions died.  Monarchies come and go. Greece who created the first Democratic experiment, died.    Evolution comes with growing pains.   And the old must give way to the new.  The Brave and the Free will hold on to what this country was meant to be, while the rest, abandon Life, Love and Liberty, who are traitors and will succumb to their nihilism.    May the Brave and the Free who hold sacred, Life, Love and Liberty survive to restore a people to a land to do what is right and good.

As a spiritual person, I don’t believe, I pursue to know.      I do have one irrational belief.  I believe in the inherent goodness of mankind.    Sometimes I am justified in this belief, other times I am severely disappointed.    This belief is not what one  expects to exist, it is a belief as a prayer and internal work of Love to desire it to exist.            In this hard exterior, is Love.  That appears to be hidden and unseen except by those who share in the path and the work.      The proof shall be in the work and its success.

Life, Love and Truth in harmony begets integrity.   That is one half of the seed.

 

 

 

LHP, RHP paths, roads, light, dark

Good Vs Evil 1

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Good Vs Evil 2

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Good VS Evil 3?

Which relationship of evil do you envision?  None of the Above?

LHP and RHP, Left Hand Path and Right Hand Path  two concepts that have been bantered, chewed, and fought over because they have been conflated and mixed into other concepts.

In different magical traditions LHP and RHP mean different things.

The underlying concepts of Light, Dark, Good, Bad, Evil, Heaven, Hell, Overworld, and Underworld all have mixed  and overlapping meanings, that further confuse the meanings of these LHP and RHP.  The discussions of all these things have been overdone, to death, in various magical and spiritual forums.     The added dimensions of Morales and Ethics is another.     Philosophically consequences are heavily steeped to the nature and practice of each tradition.

Good vs. Bad

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Good and Bad are valuations. They are relative to each person and how they value their life and all other things.    Relatively Good and Bad are as normal and different from one being to another.         As Morticia Addams says “Normal is an illusion”.            Many folk form Wiccan, other Earth based, or Pagan belief systems, look at Birth, Life and Death, the cycle of life as neither good nor bad.  It is.      As far as Evil goes, some don’t believe in it.

Heaven and Hell   versus  Overworld and Underworld,  not necessarily the same thing.      For most people the distinction is a philosophical one.    Heaven, sumerland, the here-after of what ever place is a matter of belief.    And for others Hell is a matter of belief based on the Divine supernatural order  by the pantheon, gods and cultural expectations.    The valuation is based on belief.       Shaman, Mystics and others who travel these realms,  may attribute  one or the other as an overworld or an underworld.   The Natural spiritual planes have underworlds and overworlds.   They may or may not overlap  with the Heavens and Hells of their beliefs.     Not all underworlds are based on evil.    They are based on spiritual dynamics of spirit.       Spirit that  are artifacts of time, or where time collapses, this is your underworld.     Where things are replicated duplicate and exist through time, is your overworld.        The dynamic of worship of a being,  an affinity with practices, places  and events through time give a sense of immortality.        Shamanically, technically it appears brighter.   Underworlds  appear darker.   There are underworlds where the sun is out all the time and still isn’t as bright as an overworld.  And there are overworlds based on the moon,  and night where they are considerably darker.      Light and dark became and is another  subjective valuation.   Granted  primitive man, living amongst predators that hunt at night, is a bad thing, not evil.    There are realms where underworld and overworld elements are mixed.     The beings  that live in such places,  fae, gods and everything in between are just as capricious as humans, good bad and indifferent.

It is here that darkness and the mystical perception of it, albeit colored by ancestors concerns come into play.      In the overworld and underworld dynamic that comes into play with Heavens and Hells,    good and healthy practices, that met with  and are judged worthy and good by gods,  this implies a life beyond death.  An acceptance into a realm of relatively more light, and adjudged good, by the gods and your society makes it a personal good.     Here ethics  are applied based on the morales and stipulations of the divine.    Ethics  are a shared based set of good behaviors for a society, and when there is a religion, implies that they should be part of one’s morales.        Infernal creatures of the underworld hells, exist only in the sense that they are perpetuated by the  constant bad behaviors that exist through time, taboos, and sins (behaviors against the ethical moraes and dictates of the culture and religion that one is bound to)   the aspects of spirit   that don’t exist through time  suffer through a backdrop of change and chaos, where only nature  that overlaps it in any detail is the only structure left.       Over time and ever deeper levels of hell the maelstrom of unstructured time eats away the last remnants of that which is not part of structured and timeless events, places, beings and things.             In the natural planes of overworld and underworld there is no Evil.   Just  is.   The subjective bad valuations are only as consistent with what ceases to exist and our relationships with it.

The supernatural existence of underworlds as hells, go contrary to the religion, beings, places and things.   And infernal creatures that exist do so under the auspices of people, places and things, maintain that which contradicts the heavenly order.    With people and beings involved this gets sticky and messy.  The convolutions in the relative valuations, and the actual  value of these  religious ordering of the spiritual world, lives and dies, also.  Many Abrahamic beliefs conflate their supernatural order as perfect good and everlasting.

The concept of a perfect good and everlasting was introduced by Greek Philosophers and by an aberration of beliefs that the Zoroastrians created.     The Greeks believed in Ideals.   Idealized perfect good with the natural world was what one who wish to strive to be perfect would strive for.           The Zoroastrians took two  God concepts  of  Enlil and Enki from Sumeria and the Akkadians,   and turned them into   Ahura Mazda and Angra Mainyu or Ahriman.    Enki, like Erebus of the Greeks, were deep underworld beings, that were more associated with water, the source of life.    Hades was not a primordial  but represented the current God’s (Zeus) vision of the afterlife for people.      Many of the ancient people didn’t really conceive of an afterlife.   Much less being able to be associated with the Gods unless they made you a divine being.       The Zoroastrians  created a myth about Enlil’s Father Anu who from Earth gave birth to two sons.    Ahura Mazda was born first and created everything.   Ahriman was born second, and there was not one place in the universe for Ahriman to create anything.     This is a far cry from the predecessor beliefs.   This  was an absolute creation, and jealousy that wants to destroy creation to create its own.    Here lies the first dichotomy, where Evil takes its entrance into the psyche of mankind.     The idea that there are forces that are willing to destroy what exists.  All of it, good, bad and indifferent, along with the hells, heavens and all else.   So it may create.            Evil the antithesis of life took and shaped how we viewed the world.     This concept of truth ‘ashe’  was what kept the world in order.   Druj the lie, is what was done to destroy the world and all of life.    This absolute concept of Evil took the concept of bad and Idealized it.

These concepts were absorbed into the Abrahamic beliefs.  When Persia  conquered Babylon,  and freed the Jews, their belief constructs were brought with them and infused the Judean practices.        The minor  being that was called the advocate, a fallen Angel, that was there to test  faith and belief of the Hebrew god, was promoted in various mythologies.    Shaitin  is cognate with Sais and egyption god of fate.     Tampering with the destinies and almost a mythic undercurrent of free will to be exorcised in creation, involving mankind, obviously.

Lets mix this up a bit.    The Akkadian and Sumerian  beliefs got mixed in with the Assyrians.      These gods, including Ahura Mazda, and the Hebrew Yahweh were called Ashuras.    Ahriman and all the primitive beings under his thrall were called Devi’s.   This is where the term devil comes from.    Ashura  is cognate with Asura or those beings that are not Sun Gods in pre-Brahmanic faiths of India.  The story has two sibling clans  Devis and Ashuras.  The Devis are the class of Gods that are worshipped today in India along with Suryas, Yakshas (some of them, there are demon classes there also) and the Asuras  (The Jealous Gods) were on the outs.        God in the Old Testament says of Himself that He is a Jealous God.

Technically Ahriman isn’t a Devi.   However this is the name construct given to him and the spirits he controls.   (If he couldn’t create them he had to seduce them).

The Zoroastrians made very vivid pictures of Heaven and Hell.  Heaven based on the planets, and Hells based on their sins against the Morals and Ethics of the culture.     How much of this is made up to scare people into being controlled, and what hells were manifested because of belief, probably both.     This too influenced the Greeks, the Jews and the rest the world’s religions coming from the middle east.

Demon comes from the Greek word Daemon, a spirit, usually connected with a place, or a set of behaviors and practices.    This is not a soul of a being, but a functioning spirit.   The discussion between soul and spirit is a separate discussion.    My previous article speaks to that.

Now where the “Devil” by any other name, and other beliefs, practices and religions,  where the Devil was an advocate for humans.   Encouraging them to become god like and not just abject slave to service the Gods, this was not what the gods wanted.      Whether it was the Devil or Prometheus,   or any supernatural being that descended to encourage people is where the devil becomes an anti-hero.       The creators of humans are either good or bad, indifferent, but people were expected to toe the line.     The advocate for humans depending on the religion was either a good or bad guy.

 

Right hand of God, the Right Hand Path,  that was one way of looking at defining RHP.   Hands in general were sacred.    There were two places I know of  that speak of LHP vs RHP in history.     Vedic Yoga practices  speak of liberation or Moksha and separation from all attachment and becoming one with God was considered RHP.      The LHP practice was called Tantric.    This was not about committing all sorts of evil atrocities.     The idea was that people who had to deal with life and could not be monastic and deal with a total detachment from the world, had to learn detachment by doing the everyday things.     Some have taken it to mean doing all of the taboos.       In the end, good, bad and indifferent were just part of life.    If one learned to become indifferent to it all, emotionally and spiritually detached,  the illusion of life could fall away, the same as it was for those living in monasteries who became detached directly.  Because  some schools practiced taboos, and in the light of western observers, these practices were offensive, the label of evil was attached.     The other concept of LHP was that of being an illegitimate child.     Children that were heirs were from the Right Hand.     Children of the left hand were illegitimate.  They were bar sinister (sinister for left).   Bastards by any other name had it rough and had to work harder than their half brothers and sisters who claimed inheritance.  This social drama and the term sinister made left handedness and the concept of the Left Hand unpalatable.

Here we are in post Renaissance Europe with all of these concepts, already muddied by two millennia re-interpretations and misinterpretations.

Metaphysical practices and magic where people  worked with the children of God (Angels) to become children  of God being legitimate heirs to heaven,  the Right Hand Path is defined.           Left Hand Path, magicians who by their prowess ascending in their adepthood as being counterparts to their Angelic peers, could control demons.       Demons dealt with, in theory, the day in and day out functions of life, along with evil aspects of man.  LHP of working with demons and taboo energy, essentially they have to be in control of it and be above it at the same time.  This is a western Tantric magical practice.   Now there are those who identified and or worshipped the anti-hero gods, from myth, from philosophy, and or rebellion to the hypocritical order of the “so-called” good.  Here the LHP as a belief, and also, for those in the RHP, the controlling of demons, for magical  and or spiritual purposes, is a utilitarian practice.      The LHP  in the face of a conservative culture that marginalizes people, in spite of the taboos and laws of the elite of any culture, flourishes.

LHP, underworlds, darkness, relative badness are not necessarily evil.    There shaman and energy workers of various cultures that work with either side or both.    The nature and tendencies for LHP practitioners and the source of their beliefs and experiences may draw them toward antisocial behaviors against  adopted morales and ethics of their prevalent culture.  Some revel in the idea of evil, although they are not dedicated to the destruction of the universe for some being that wants a piece of the action.     They just want life and all that it has to offer for themselves.     Does this even make them bad?     Depending on the social circumstance, not necessarily.

Black Magic is the use of magic against people’s  or sentient beings will.  RHP and LHP both can be Black Magic.

I have met satanists that are fun loving people.   I have met Orthodox Theistic Satanists, and yes they are evil.    I lived with Bullies and Sociopaths, who are Evil.  They destroy lives, circumstances and anything decent, with no intent of anything beyond their own amusement.    This is Evil.  Fascists are evil.

I have met many people who are RHP or very moralistic, who are overweening, arrogant, sadistic evil individuals.   They end up supporting ossified social constructs that are destructive to life and the growth of people and society.

Most  who banter LHP and RHP, Light vs. Dark, Good and Evil, have no clue to the origins or the depths  of the meaning of each.       Conversation is necessary to tease out what people mean and where they are at.  And more so, people have to check their assumptions about everything so they can hear  what others are saying.   And instead of making assertions, ask questions where people are at and what they mean and why.  Failing that, it destroys life, relationship, understanding, it participates in the lies of all our given assumptions support.    That too is an evil.

Some of us have been in the battle with Evil, physical, emotional, mental and spiritual.    When they fight for Life, Love and Truth,  understanding goes a long way, to create a better world.  Destroying the Destroyers becomes a sacred task.

 

LIVES MATTERS #not TRUTH MATTERS #not

The Second Triangle of Immortality is Life, Love and Truth   in Harmony creates Integrity.

The First Triangle is  Mind, Emotion and Body in balance creates Spirit.

Spirit and Integrity creates and maintains Soul.

Truth is the singular most important thing that can help people get along and is the absolute necessity for Gods to exist and for anyone who wishes to obtain immortality in any of the World’s belief systems.

Cognitive Dissonance is the most singularly frustrating thing when dealing with people.  It is when their brain’s  operating system is based on emotions.  They switch from one operating system to another by a constant flow of emotions.    It is from this very flow of emotions people gauge their comfort level of information based on these emotions and how they evoke the next set of emotions.   Sadly,  cognitive abilities, analytical skills, and information don’t  buffer well between these  emotional states.  There is an extremely limited overlap of information and abilities from one emotion to another and fail people miserably.   Disjointed analytical tools live in different emotional operating systems.

People live constantly in cognitive dissonance their whole lives.    The very purpose of meditation and contemplation is to create a singular  state of mind which holds all the data and analytical skills in one place to grow and to be improved upon.  Then no one can relate to these people because their emotions and data don’t match the patterns that make them comfortable.

Comfort and a fear from being made uncomfortable, beliefs from comfort regardless of the context of the thoughts and feelings don’t match what is expected,  is out right rejected.

Cognitive Dissonance is the very playground sociopaths, psychopaths,  FOX news, Conservative Think tanks & social media outlets, and every one in a culture that expects a specific sets of actions and reactions works from.   It works because it is an empirical  logic that shows for  most of one’s actions works.   It is lazy and economical requiring no thinking whatsoever.   People think they think; however, listen to them say “I believe”, “I feel”, and “you should” which are all speaking from a set of programmed responses.

They take everything they think, feel and believe for granted.  Because it feels right, they believe it to be true.

The sad fact is there is truth in each of these beliefs which is turned in to an actionable emotionally charged reaction.   The context,  and circumstances are missed.

Case in point, I posted a simple meme in the wake of  yet another murder of a black man by police officers.  “STOP KILLING BLACK PEOPLE”.    That is it.

A good friend of mine simply stated All people’s lives matter.  She cares about every one, is multi-ethnic and has a broad view of life.    Another friend of mine gets triggered  from what would sound like #AllLivesMatter.       To put this in context of #BLACKLIVESMATTER as part of a post on Treyvon Martin’s Murderer, George Zimmerman’s, acquittal.   Since then many other black people are being murdered or killed by police, in jails, and elsewhere.   Many are innocent and demanding their rights.  Lately in our society that will get you killed.    Post Ferguson Missouri, with Michael Brown being murdered,  white racist provocateurs who started shooting into a peaceful demonstration exacerbated an ever worsening situation.   What came out at that time from white supremacist social media trolls, was a meme from conservative, bigoted think tanks: #AllLivesMatter.  There was a space of time this meme got out into liberal environments and was embraced by well meaning people.     Quickly people realized this was an attempt to “whitewash” and down play all the severe issues #BlackLivesMatter embraced.   It was indeed meant to diffuse the this movement with a racist  inference that white people lives matter.    This created even more confusion with the intent of each.  My friend  did not mean to infer or embrace this whitewash propaganda tool.   If you knew her this would be the last thing on her mind.    My other friends were severely triggered  and acted as if this was the intent.     When people are getting verbally assaulted or have their sense of self assaulted, they fight back.    They each did.     Each of them I like and would want to spend a lot of time with.    They all, if given a chance, would probably think everybody is a good and great person.   The think tank that created this racist meme of #ALLLIVESMATTER succeeded in having people tear each other apart.

I failed.

I shared something I feel and what should be a simple action and a simple truth.

I failed because what I said was empty without a personal action.

I failed because the problem is so much bigger than a simple meme.

I failed my friends because by sharing this it divided people who should work together.

To address these issues, and other issues like:   rape, rape culture, corporate greed, citizens united, labor inequality, gender inequality, racism, bigotry,  income inequality, lack of health care, lack of education,  disability, retirement, healthcare, foreign policies, the enslavement of country by debt, corporate ownership and manipulation of government,  foreign wars,  wars that support an industrial complex, education inequality,  economy, corporate tax loopholes, misogyny, hate groups,  and so many others, they are all intertwined.

We are taught to label and put simple handles, to make how we deal with specific issues easy.  They are based on beliefs, values and judgements, that are not necessarily our own.   They are convenient rationalizations.  For some they are decent, and others they are horribly bad.   The fact is we don’t actually work with so many of these issues directly, however we feel a need to identify one way or another as if it defines us in society.  And it does because it attracts and detracts the type of people we can work with at some level.   It is a shorthand that is easy and natural.  It is easy and natural for it to be manipulated by those who know these issues and people at a much deeper level.  Because we believe we are in control of our lives, this  thought that others control our very thoughts, emotions and beliefs is difficult to believe.

All these issues are so big, so massive, it is overwhelming.   It is easier to focus on singular issues as an issue unto themselves.     We have been taught to manage things with small incremental changes.    This is a perpetual treadmill, a drudgery of paperwork,, housekeeping, bureaucracy, and industry to make everything and do everything as cheaply as possible, to further make us slaves to our work, culture and the way things are done.

What have we done?  What activism have we done?  Have we at least stood up for our friends?  Have we taken care of the sick, the poor, or the disabled?    Have we voted?  Do we know or care what the local elections look like, what issues they are bringing?   We have stood up for our friends.  We share memes, and stories.  Have we asked for facts, figures, and what the truth is, or do we just repeat what others have sent?

What can I, a single person, do?      Do we know enough about others to stand with them and do a protest?   Do I have bail money?  Do I have friends, lawyers and a support structure to take care of me, my children, my family, and  to keep them from being killed at least?  And what do politicians and people in power care about protests, petitions, and our facebook memes?   Nothing.    Zip, notta, nothing.  Zero.   And if you do stir some truth up, a little funding here and there, and these nutjob  provocateurs make the protesters look crazy,  or shoot them, or cause other mischief.  What is the effect?  Again, zip zero nothing.  We are supposed to stare at all the divisive emotional differences, without the depth of investigation they deserve only to be given emotional divisive issues to focus on.

We don’t have to convince the choir.   The nutjobs aren’t on our friend’s lists.  If they are they probably turned off following the sources to our memes.   We have done that with theirs. Or we simply have unfriended those who are so heinously off into their own little world.

All the truth in the world won’t change  scared, feeble minded people, who have lost their jobs, their retirements, their way of living, who have been made to be afraid of everything and everybody. They are fighting for the same  little modicum of life and justice they use to have.  Hell, people would be happy with what they have now.    And they know they are losing it one bit of a time.  They have been lied to by a society that is sociopathic, narcissistic and led by psychopaths, that care not one wit about them or any of us.

Is there anyone you trust?   Heck, if you are following me on social media, you can almost guarantee people who are following me are decent people.    Thank you for what trust you have in me to post or share things that matter to you, that supports you.  Thank you for sharing things with me that uplift me and support the type of person I choose to be.  I hope I do the same for you.   Do you trust me?  Do you trust the people that follow me and post stuff on my stuff?

Who thinks this stuff through and keeps updated on various things?   I don’t know everything.  Who tries to be fair and have a level view of things from multiple angles?    Is that a leader or a politician?   A politician works to get emotional support and tacit approval for what they do.   A vote, in a corrupt, rigged, and representative of only the richest supporters is what you get.  It is a game of charades.     It use to be they at least played along and paid lip service to what we as a people care about.      Instead of a meaningful platform, they took issues that would move people and assemble them as a campaign marketing tool.     Can you trust them to get experts to tell them what to do?

So, what we do lacks power or leverage.   Activism, voting, and through the most positive thing  by education, and that is corrupted by propaganda, media and misinformation.  Who can we trust?   Do you have leaders?   Do you empower them?  Do you support them?  Is the ideas, or ideals worth working for,  dying for, worth sacrificing yourself for?  Are they worth it?   What are we worth?

Revolutionaries  the thinkers, philosophers and  ideas to make things better are systematically destroyed by those who have grabbed power.  They promote what cements power in the vacuum left by the destruction of  what was bad with what is the new evil corrupt mechanisms.

So when it comes to power, Truth doesn’t matter, and Lives don’t matter.  The milieu of the existential angst of the powerless, prey on each other.   And if they are motivated against powers that be, the underlying power of the new order is supporting it.

“I can hire one half of the working class to kill the other half.Said by Jay Gould.  Today, the NRA right wing, controlling the conservative right who are supporting our corporate neo-fascists are being souped up to kill minorities, anybody who isn’t conservative christian, and each other when it suits them.

I don’t care who does the electing, so long as I get to do the nominating.” Said by William M. Tweed   This has been an ongoing strategy of the political parties, and those that sponsor them for most of our country’s life.    Each segment of population that gets the vote, the outcome has already been predetermined.

Truth matters and Lives matters.   They are our most precious resources that need to be cherished.     We need leaders, and the truth is there is a cost to make them, to feed them and all the endeavors, that deserve our efforts, our lives and sacrifices.  Because we have so few of them, we need to create them and back them up.

We have failed our country because we have let what is going on in the past 100 years or more happen.  We have allowed ourselves to be blinded by mouthing platitudes, principles and morals without context, thought, review, or be guided by intelligence and spirit.     We have allowed  ourselves to be uneducated and to be led by valueless, misguided or misled politicians who become convinced of the sacerdotal kool aid offered by those in power. They have not listened to, nor supported those who sacrificed their lives to know the truth of things, and those who sacrificed their lives to make a better country for themselves and their children.    We forgot to question, to fight for something greater than ourselves.  We have been inured to people’s suffering, and engendered greed and selfishness as a virtue.

If we can not trust a few close people, how can you trust one to become a leader, to create the power to change society?  The power is in us collectively, and we need a vision and a visionary to contain and wield that power, who is responsible to the people who would tear them to shreds if he or she betrays the people.    Those who have economic power who hire mercenaries, police, politicians, lawyers, doctors and soldiers are responsible only to themselves and get the other people seduced by power and greed to kill each other off.

All Lives, Truth and Living don’t matter, if the truth is that you are powerless to change a damn thing.   It doesn’t matter if we can’t talk with each other, trust someone to sort it out and back them up if you aren’t willing or able to do it yourself.  If you can’t build a culture where we get along, then we are separated, manipulated and are a commodity for someone else’s use.

I have and still get beat up by trying to build the bridges between people.    The fact is people still cling to their narrow ways generally, and rarely bridge that gap of understanding between individuals or groups.       To manage the issue at large one has to have 50,000 foot view of the problem and be able to tend to those issues.   People in general do not have the capacity to see that.  Because they don’t have the capacity they can’t and won’t believe the person who is trying to  help them bridge the gap.     This was true 30 years ago and it is more true now.    If you cannot get two cliques of of people to work together, over a simple issue, how do you manage this with large issues across a whole country?

If people could give each other a break, check their assumptions and their emotions,  ask for clarification we might get dialogues going.   If we are willing to entertain another person’s point of view we might be able to build bridges.  If we cultivate people that can find a way between two points of view you create statesman.  If we support people who bring better ideas, and trust people to develop better world, we might get a world that we may be more engaged in and trusting each other to become mutually decent citizens.

People Embracing Change is about building such a culture.   I may be unworthy for such an undertaking.  Maybe I am.   Maybe you are.  This will need a fundamental change in the way we think, feel and behave.     And that is too scary.    Lives will matter if we have absolutely honest relationships with ourselves, others and the world around us.   That would be an act of love that is too scary to commit to.  The Truth is we are too afraid to live a Life that Matters,  or are crushed by those who are afraid of that change.

What we need to do is build and create, leaders, cultures and relationships.  We need to study and speak to each other’s truths and experiences and build common ground.   We need to acknowledge each other’s hurts and experiences.  We have to be able to move beyond our hurts and our experiences, to build new lives.  Build new Lives that Matter together.  Then we will embody the living truth.

 

 

 

In response to a lament of the loss of Elders

The Rantin Raven : This is why we can’t have nice things. “On Patheos: Agora”

I saw Elders being pushed to the side over 25 years ago. And others going solitary.
I see some elders being respected in some communities.
It depends on the type of community and the personality of the groups of people drawn to each.
People noted the various influxes of Pagan/Wiccans that have joined the community. Some may choose a good initiatory tradition and stick with it, respecting and Elder.
Many that are taught a one true way ( and I have heard it called “The Wicca”) don’t leave room for those who see the basic Wiccan ritual format as a training mechanism. And those who take it as a religion versus those who pursue the magical spirituality of it.
This country in the mainstream and many of those who have joined suffer from the mainstream discrimination of ageism. And like others have said join a movement that helps them justify their lifestyle without a true type of morality and ethics.
And since the burgeoning of Wicca from the 60’s feminist empowerment era, and the 60’s in general, authority, organization and hope of respect of those of whom paved the way gets diminished when that attitude and culture is still present when they get “there” and represent that which was thrown out with the bath water.
Couple this with the fact that there are parasites and sociopaths, both “so-called” leaders and coveners, that are bane to the Traditionalists or any serious seeker.
I, a male from NY from  those Female only times and places, through having had my own experiences that simulate what an initiatory tradition could have provided but then I could not culturally fit, for one reason or another. I had to go solitary. It is only after decades, and going where reputable long standing elders show up, do I get any type of recognition. The true ” The Wicca” and those religious and make stuff up as they go, to stroke their ego types, (sociopaths that have their enablers attack you) do every thing they can to keep you out their section of the community. Then I watch what larger community re-fragment.
When you see it coming, and people are conditioned to isolate themselves, sociopaths and narcissists take full advantage of that. Groups can’t get as big as they used to because of this influx and conditioning to respond to these types of people.
I haven’t seen one group in 20 years that teaches meditation anymore. The last Elder (now Past- Lady Amethyst) that taught anything about energy, vibration, and the reason for ritual adherence. Nor have I seen anyone speak to building an astral framework and ritual space except for Thorn Coyle.
I just listened to an Ifa traditionalists where the one Baba wanted to get people back to talk about the magical and spiritual work that the various paths of the Oriesha have versus the surface rituals and practices that people do. It is endemic to the spirituality of many traditions.
And it is part of the mainstream culture. No one trusts anyone, no group, no leader and wouldn’t know who to trust, to say that is a leader and for these reasons. People don’t waste time to listen to reasons, history, or exercise their own brain and abilities to think it through for themselves. People follow what gives them those feels, with no idea what or where it comes from, or who is manipulating it and how.
The Elders who try to teach any of these truly empowering things are shown the door with some sort of social kick in the pants.
There are few,  who have good solid working traditions and people earnestly supporting them, If what you say is true makes you and yours rare of what and whom I know.
Here is the by-word, community, and by that diversity and leadership. Who do you trust, and how do you cultivate leaders? A tribe has those and multiple societies with different religious and spiritual traditions, along with a warrior, women’s, men’s and other practical day in and day out societies. That is what my group is working on. And yes we get next to zero interest. They don’t see a value in it. They want to see what’s in it for them.
And the Elders that say they are retiring from Wicca and going to more traditional witchcraft, being a witch, wizard, is the continuing study of self, lore and magical practices, and extending their relationship with the divine and nature, without being impeded by those who have made Wicca an altogether stultifying but small organized religion, managed by many, by many standards, who couldn’t earn a traditional third degree. Those who see the Gods and the spirits know.
And nowadays, vampires, the added extra bonus of spiritual environment and sociopaths, do what I want versus in perfect love and trust. Every larger meetup or gathering I go to, I and my group have to protect people from them. Witch by definition is what you do for yourself. Wicca is a religion and a framework, for some these magical training traditions. Shamans learn to serve a tribe. No Tribe, no community, no reliance on wisdom of elders, but the self serving of each little group manipulating each other. Yes many of us have had to survive, recuperate from burnout, or just be a victim of abuse.

Those of you have survived with a cadre of an honest tradition. I salute you.
I have seen Elders from various traditions manage to work together for a time here and there. The underlying lack of structure, and that thing that is a hypocritical stone stuck in my throat, working by consensus, that develops only the most skilled of the emotional manipulating leaders, that drive the core founders and workers away, no there won’t be a coherent community honoring Elders.
Again I am doing what I can to teach. Many are concerned with who I trained under, what traditions and how successful I’ve been without any context or understanding of what I know. The paucity of capable people who have had any adept experiences are few and the rest fake it, while flaunting a more marketable feel good group. People will get what they get.
Now that I put myself out here, I expect to be hammered. Have at it.
Most of those who have responded to this post what you say is true and good, and from your sets of experiences, I have seen also. I just hope the one thing in pagan communities are not interested in is community and leadership and culture is the very thing that they need. And now without any good culture to be based off of, one must be created to be a model not only for ourselves, but for the world.
Archonstone

peopleembrachingchange.com